• We've just upgraded this forum to a major new version. It looks slightly different and has different menu options.

    Please let me know if there are any issues you encounter with this upgrade, I'm still getting my head round it! Tolerance and a bit of time would be most appreciated.

    Thanks Neil

Moody 41,42,425

Mark Dixon

Mark Dixon
Temporary Member
#1
Of all the models that originated from the M41 molds, is there one or more that are considered more or less a "red headed stepchild" ? If so why?
 

Peter Wright

Peter Wright
Boat name
WILD THYME
Berth
Suffolk Yacht Harbour
Boat type
Moody 425
Cruising area
North Sea, English Channel, Biscay
#2
Hi Mark,

With your surname, I'd have thought you know all about these boats, but perhaps not all Dixons are related to each other.

Firstly, there was no Moody 42 coming from the M41 moulds - the series that developed from this design was M41, M419. M422 and M425, built over he period from 1984 to 1991. You can find details of these (and other Moodys) in the Moody Archive, accessed from a link towards the bottom of the left hand side of the home page.

Secondly, being partial to redheads, I'm not sure what you mean by a redheaded stepchild, but generally, issues with earlier models were designed out as the series developed, so the M425 represents the most developed version (but note that our boat is a M425, so I would say that!). The Moody 42 (circa 2000) was a development of the Moody 40 (circa 1990's), a later, rather different design, although sharing the qualities for which Bill Dixon is well known. The M425 was replaced in 1991 by the all new Moody 44

An example of this evolution is the standing rigging in the M41 which had 2 issues:
  • the shroud chainplates are bolted to part bulkheads below the deck. On the M41, one pair of chainplates do not line up fore and aft with the part bulkhead, so the chainplate is packed out from the bulkhead giving a less robust load path. On later models, revision of the layout below allowed these part bulkheads to be moved so that they align with the chainplate, eliminating that issue.
  • the M41 featured a baby stay, which was replaced in the later models by forward lower shrouds

The hulls of the latter 2 differed in having a sugar scoop stern added, creating space for a large lazarette which replaced the cockpit locker making more space below decks. None of them were lemons, if that's the meaning of your russet haired stepchild and, imho, the change from the M419 to the M422 was probably the largest of the three steps in development.

Hope this helps,

Peter.
 

Mark Dixon

Mark Dixon
Temporary Member
#3
Thanks and I like redheads too, just a turn of phrase. What would the issues of moving the chain plates to the outside of the hull on M41? And I would be pleased if I were related, I know my line comes from the Borders.
 

Peter Wright

Peter Wright
Boat name
WILD THYME
Berth
Suffolk Yacht Harbour
Boat type
Moody 425
Cruising area
North Sea, English Channel, Biscay
#4
Hi Mark,

You have misunderstood what I wrote about chainplates - they are not outside the hull on any of these models. On the M41, the chainplate is out of line with the part bulkhead to which it is secured in a fore and aft sense, so there is a need for packing between the chainplate and the part bulkhead. The issue here is that when a bolted joint, loaded in shear as this one is, includes a packing piece, you inevitably introduce a couple ( turning force) into the joint, which is almost zero without a packing piece. The change was to move the part bulkhead in later models so the two components line up and the chain plates all mount directly on their part bulkheads with no packing.

If you inspect any of these Moodys, you will see that the chainplates pass through the side decks with small stainless steel plates screwed downaround them to seal the penetration. Below decks, the chainplates and the part bulkheads to which they are secured are hidden behind the beautiful cabinetry so it's not easy to see them.

Peter.
 

Mark Dixon

Mark Dixon
Temporary Member
#5
I understood what you meant, but I was inquiring about the possibility if I were going to address the chainplate issue what about relocating and making new chainplates so that it would be on the outside of the hull thus not passing through the top of the side deck
 

Peter Wright

Peter Wright
Boat name
WILD THYME
Berth
Suffolk Yacht Harbour
Boat type
Moody 425
Cruising area
North Sea, English Channel, Biscay
#6
Mark,

That would require a complete rework of the rig design, as you would be widening the shroud base, which in turn would increase the headsail sheeting angle, so destroying the windward performance.

This is not really an appropriate discussion for this board - I cited the chainplate issue simply as an example of the development of the series from one model to the next. There are solutions to the chainplate and the babystay issue,
which do not require a new rig design which you can find by searching on the info Exchange board, which is also the appropriate place for technical discussions.

Peter.
 

Neil Eccles

Neil Eccles
General Committee
GC Support Team
MOA Position
Website Editor
Boat name
CUTAWAY
Berth
Vannes
Boat type
Moody 42
Cruising area
West Coast of France and North Coast Of Spain
#8
Mark - what you suggest is a naval architect issue - as Peter says, outside this board and the MOA really. The only person who could answer your query would be Bill Dixon, your namesake and the designer.

Kindest

Neil
 

Robert Cardinal

Robert Cardinal
Boat name
MOODY MISTRESS
Berth
Vancouver
Boat type
Moody 425
Cruising area
Mediterranean
#10
The buyers perspective always comes into play when accessing the values of a used boat. The 419 while sharing certain features of the 422 and the later 425 carry a much lower price on average. The 422 and the later 425 seem to be in similar price ranges with the 425 possibly averaging a slightly higher price. R
 

Micky Barnes

Michael Barnes
Boat name
LIESEL
Berth
Hamble
Boat type
Moody 41
Cruising area
South Coast
#11
Mark, As has been suggested by others, I would caution against rig change. My M41 is 1983 and so far have had no troubles with chainplates. However I have removed the chainplate covers fairly frequently in order to replace the sealant. Once when the mast was down to renew some of the rigging I removed the chain plate covers and split them so that they could be fully removed with the mast still up - this applied to cap shrouds and lowers.
Also previous owner replaced the baby stay with forward lowers - brilliant.
Micky
 

Robert Lanford

ROBERT LANFORD
Registered Guest
#12
Hello. I too am interested in pursuing a purchase of a M419, possibly a centerboard version. Thank you for allowing my participation. I have already gotten several questions answered by reading previous threads. Are there any outstanding upgrades to the 419 that you can suggest that I look for and or look forward to performing (additional to the chainplate sealing)? There are many positive reviews in the commercial blogosphere and a few negatives concerning construction of the 419s i.e. bulkhead tabbing etc. I would rather get the straight info. from owners than trusting contributors of questionable knowledge.
Thanks you for any info.
Robert
 

Micky Barnes

Michael Barnes
Boat name
LIESEL
Berth
Hamble
Boat type
Moody 41
Cruising area
South Coast
#13
Robert , I am delighted with my M41 having bought from original owner in 2000. I have recently had the hydraulic panel for the lifting keel renewed with one used by Southerly yachts. Previous owner replaced baby stay with forward lowers which is excellent, also he fitted an inner forestay to take a working jib that can be reefed. There are various other minor improvements that I have made.

Mine is certainly not for sale but there is a M41, with a lifting keel, for sale in the "Boats for sale" section. Give Chris Haire a call.

"My yacht of over 27 years is now for sale. Its in very good condition with a high specification and many upgrades. Can be viewed - on the hard - at Swale Marina Conyer Kent UK . To make contact either email me through this site or text +905353395501 or email: hairechris (at) hotmail.com Price now reduced now to £48,000. "
 

Robert Lanford

ROBERT LANFORD
Registered Guest
#14
Micky, Thanks for the information, and congratulations on your experience with the M41. I have been admiring Mr. Haire's boat for some time and will be contacting him if I can accumulate enough cash to be in range of his offer. After looking at many makes and models, the M419 seems to cover my needs quite well. Thanks again--Robert
 

Micky Barnes

Michael Barnes
Boat name
LIESEL
Berth
Hamble
Boat type
Moody 41
Cruising area
South Coast
#15
Robert, The 419 is of course a newer boat so you will find that they are a little more expensive, depending on equipment on board and condition. The only difference between them is the aft cabin. With the 41 sleeping is across the boat therefore no need for lee cloths. If you do purchase there are plenty on this website who can help you with any details. Best of luck. Micky
 
Top